Dr. Ben Carson Interview: Dignity or Dreadventism?

Defining some terms may be helpful:

Messchatology — This is a strange blend of Adventist eschatology and left-wing politics, wrapped around the axle of the Adventist Message. It is often fostered by ideologically captured religious liberty departments, authors and institutions. One of it's primary motivators is fear (Dreadventism), the other is pride "I sit a queen and shall see no sorrow" (Rev. 18"7); "I am special."

"Let us do evil (or vote for it) that good may come" is the mantra of this polyamorous marriage between "religious liberty", left-wing politics, and Adventist eschatology. Mingling these ingredients into an odd stew, we become intoxicated, staggering, hiccuping bastions of Messchatology looking for the softest place to fall. This is the approach of SDA pop-liberals, of which we have a heavy infestation in North America.

Hadventists — They once had our Message but have traded it away for a bowl of modern lentils. The antidote to this condition is to hold fast to the wonderful Advent Message (Isaiah 56:4; 1 Thessalonians 5:21; Hebrews 10:23; Revelation 2:25). The prophecies will not fail; they will happen in God's good time. False religion will persecute true religion in the Time of the End; all who dwell on the earth will worship the Beast and his image, except for a Remnant, who love God sincerely and follow Him wherever He goes.  We can "overcome evil with good", by His grace (Romans 12:21).

Dreadventism — Those who live in great fear of Sunday Law. They exchange the patience of the saints for the panic of the saints, reacting with fight or flight towards most every national occurrence. For many Dreadventists, it is ok to give the state immoral power over our lives but it (the state) must not ever have any moral authority. Such an imbalance leads to a subconscious deconstruction of the Law of God down to one Commandment, not ten (for them, the Sabbath becomes the only thing that matters).

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Dr. Ben Carson was thrust into the political arena in 2013 as the invited speaker at the National Prayer Breakfast, with President Barack Obama present. Three years later when he jumped into the Republican Presidential Primary race in 2016, he has been one of the most visible and polarizing Adventist figures in the country—possibly the world.

Adventists have been divided on whether it is in any sense appropriate for one of our own to be involved in politics (I often wonder if those who take the negative position are familiar with the biblical stories of Joseph and Daniel, or if they are familiar with A.T. Jones’s 1888 activities).

After a distinguished career as the world’s foremost pediatric neurosurgeon at John Hopkins University Medical Center, Carson has run for president and served as President Trump’s Housing and Urban Development (HUD) Secretary. Since leaving HUD Carson has established a children’s civics curriculum, and made the rounds speaking to college students about conservative and American principles as a speaker for Young America’s Foundation (YAF).

Recently he joined Heritage and Hope Ministries to talk about his work co-chairing the White House’s Religious Liberty Commission, and to talk about broader challenges and work that lies ahead in the fight to preserve religious liberty, and liberty more broadly in the United States. I think DR. Carson did a good job balancing both prophetic caution and pragmatic prudence. Carson affirmed that he still holds to authentically Adventist views of Bible Prophecy and future events, though he rightly resisted the “Dreadventist” tendency to panic.

One of the main topics of the interview was the fact that various members of the Religious Liberty Commission have cast some shade on the idea of a wall of separation between Church and State, and even Carson had some comments perceived by some as to  that effect. Carson addressed this head on by rightly defining the State’s legitimate role, punishing evildoers that harm the security of society, and pushing back against the idea of religious laws. He also made the point that we have to understand what the American founders actually meant by a separation of church and state, and that wasn’t to bar all religious views and persons from the public square.

One major point where the Heritage and Hope hosts and Dr. Carson had some disagreements is on the goodness of the Johnson Amendment, a 1954 provision in the US tax code that prohibits all non profit organizations from endorsing political candidates. The hosts were expressing concerns about potential downsides of church’s getting in the political endorsement and fundraising business while Carson pointed out that the Johnson Amendment is government control over religious bodies. I have long viewed the Johnson Amendment to be a violation of America’s First Amendment. The government cannot, justly in my view, curtail speech by any private person or group. I agree with the hosts that churches SHOULDN’T be endorsing candidates from the pulpit, but I agree with Carson that the state should not have any say over whether or not they do.

When confronted with clips of various extremist Christian nationalist pastors and podcasters (Joel Webbon, Douglas Wilson, and others) arguing for establishing religious tests for office, suppressing the rights of non Christians or Christians of dissident sects, and other provocations Carson rightly said we should oppose such moves. He made clear that those views do not represent the views of the commission or the President. 

There was a clip shown of Dr. Carson in 2015, in Australia, stating that in his opinion it was very likely that persecution over the Sabbath could come from the political right. Carson reaffirmed that he thinks when end times persecution comes to America it will do so a backlash and overcorrection from the excesses of the left-the pendulum theory. Though, he urged the audience to remember that we do not know when those events will happen for sure, and he also stated that we do not know from what political faction the final crisis will actually be brought about—we should remain vigilant but not reactionary.

Overall I recommend that everyone go and watch the interview, which I thought was a very fruitful and balanced discussion. It was a reminder that we must have both prophetic understanding and also pragmatically make the case for liberty in tangible ways. I think Dr. Carson has done so admirably, and as an Adventist I am very glad that he has the opportunity to represent our faith at the highest levels of American politics.

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Joey Carrion is an English and Technology teacher in the Michigan Conference of SDA. He is a graduate of Andrews University with a degree in Political Science. In his spare time he enjoys shooting skeet, riding horses, reading, and volunteering with his local church in Gobles, Michigan.